Southampton-3
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Great news for SOU,the runway extension strip becomes even less relevant,and in fact probably will not happen in today's world. Given that Covid 19 comes under control by next spring,then this move by BA could be SOU saviour.One note of caution will be WIzz announcement that they are starting a base at Bournemouth,which surely will be imminent!
I'm not sure how good this news really is for SOU. BACF will operate for max 6 months of the year, for 2 days per week. The aircraft and crew will not *really* be based at SOU - it's more akin to a night-stop, so BA are not making any significant commitment to SOU. It didn't matter at STN because BACF were a relatively small player in a very large market - there was plenty of effective clear commitment from Ryanair and Jet2
There is zero chance of BA restarting their SOU base from 15 years ago. I imagine the fees paid by BACF to SOU will be low, not much more than the cost to SOU to provide airport services - and certainly not enough to generate much for the "SOU long term investment" piggy-bank
SOU as a sizeable urban area which is very unlikely to ever have significant inbound seasonal tourism, needs airlines which operate to/from SOU at least 360 days of the year, not an opportunist skimming off the seasonal high-fat cream which will dissuade anybody from setting up a real SOU-centric non-transient operation
There is zero chance of BA restarting their SOU base from 15 years ago. I imagine the fees paid by BACF to SOU will be low, not much more than the cost to SOU to provide airport services - and certainly not enough to generate much for the "SOU long term investment" piggy-bank
SOU as a sizeable urban area which is very unlikely to ever have significant inbound seasonal tourism, needs airlines which operate to/from SOU at least 360 days of the year, not an opportunist skimming off the seasonal high-fat cream which will dissuade anybody from setting up a real SOU-centric non-transient operation
Last edited by davidjohnson6; 9th Dec 2020 at 16:09.
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LBIA
And this is why it pays to be a glass half full person!
Well done to the management at SOU who have dealt with the demise of BE amazingly!
Apart from Stobart, who are in a very bad way currently, I make that now all the regional airlines in this country operating routes at SOU, indeed some have even been competing on routes. What other regional airport in the country, let alone during a global pandemic(!), can say that?
This news should not be underestimated, and leaves me with the following thoughts:
1. BACF have traditionally not strayed from their base at LCY, certainly not opening 11 new routes at a time! The fact they have chosen SOU for such an uncharacteristic move speaks volumes for SOU and its catchment. It further builds on the fact Volotea chose SOU as their first airport in the UK. These things speak volumes for SOU's potential.
2. The variety of routes is very encouraging and again speaks volumes of the confidence in SOU's potential. We have bucket and spade routes, regional French routes and even some city break routes like Berlin and Florence.
3. The fact that the frequencies are relatively low at this stage is irrelevant. The industry is obviously at a low point currently, so going all in with a base in these times is not going to happen. The possibility was someone coming along and testing the waters, and guess what, someone has. When times are better, a base could definitely be a possibility.
4. Seeing as pretty much all of the regional operators have now opened routes from SOU, I wonder if the runway extension was being built whether we would see the same urgency to open routes from the low cost carriers? As has long been discussed, their larger aircraft are not the right fit for SOU in its current state. In my opinion, we would see the same urgency, as if regional operators with their higher cost base are all very keen to have a piece of the pie, why would low cost operators with their low cost base not also see an opportunity to make money at SOU?
On the runway planning being delayed, lets hope this is not because of the BACF news, and perhaps what is going on behind the scenes with a new BE. I take comfort from the fact that it was previously delayed whilst SOU produced more reports on noise, so it could very well be true that they just need more time to produce something else to mitigate a particular concern. I suspect they will end up having to go down the appeal route, so the more stuff they collate to support their argument the better.
Lastly, although it is important to never mention anyone by name, and in turn feed the trolls if you like, I hope this latest bit of good new will give this thread some respite from their trolling and relentless negativity, but I will not hold my breath (indeed it looks like the usual suspects have already started). I would implore others to ignore their attempts at trolling though, if this thread is ever going to go back to a place of healthy debate which all other threads seem to be.
And this is why it pays to be a glass half full person!
Well done to the management at SOU who have dealt with the demise of BE amazingly!
Apart from Stobart, who are in a very bad way currently, I make that now all the regional airlines in this country operating routes at SOU, indeed some have even been competing on routes. What other regional airport in the country, let alone during a global pandemic(!), can say that?
This news should not be underestimated, and leaves me with the following thoughts:
1. BACF have traditionally not strayed from their base at LCY, certainly not opening 11 new routes at a time! The fact they have chosen SOU for such an uncharacteristic move speaks volumes for SOU and its catchment. It further builds on the fact Volotea chose SOU as their first airport in the UK. These things speak volumes for SOU's potential.
2. The variety of routes is very encouraging and again speaks volumes of the confidence in SOU's potential. We have bucket and spade routes, regional French routes and even some city break routes like Berlin and Florence.
3. The fact that the frequencies are relatively low at this stage is irrelevant. The industry is obviously at a low point currently, so going all in with a base in these times is not going to happen. The possibility was someone coming along and testing the waters, and guess what, someone has. When times are better, a base could definitely be a possibility.
4. Seeing as pretty much all of the regional operators have now opened routes from SOU, I wonder if the runway extension was being built whether we would see the same urgency to open routes from the low cost carriers? As has long been discussed, their larger aircraft are not the right fit for SOU in its current state. In my opinion, we would see the same urgency, as if regional operators with their higher cost base are all very keen to have a piece of the pie, why would low cost operators with their low cost base not also see an opportunity to make money at SOU?
On the runway planning being delayed, lets hope this is not because of the BACF news, and perhaps what is going on behind the scenes with a new BE. I take comfort from the fact that it was previously delayed whilst SOU produced more reports on noise, so it could very well be true that they just need more time to produce something else to mitigate a particular concern. I suspect they will end up having to go down the appeal route, so the more stuff they collate to support their argument the better.
Lastly, although it is important to never mention anyone by name, and in turn feed the trolls if you like, I hope this latest bit of good new will give this thread some respite from their trolling and relentless negativity, but I will not hold my breath (indeed it looks like the usual suspects have already started). I would implore others to ignore their attempts at trolling though, if this thread is ever going to go back to a place of healthy debate which all other threads seem to be.
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Point 1 is rather incorrect, you saw this exact move by BACF to STN/MAN and to a lesser extent BHX and BRS. The BER aircraft rotation is the former STN positioning/destinations.
Either way great news for SOU.
Either way great news for SOU.
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I for one think this will be a pre-curser to much more activity by BACF at SOU probably by autumn next year. Edinburgh should be increased in frequency at an appropriate time and with capacity to hand. It’s all up to us to support these new routes now.
If I were SOU management I’d be doing everything possible to sweeten BACF and keep them happy so that growth is forthcoming. I’m sure they’re already doing this and well done to them!
Does anyone know if the flights are being operated by ERJ-190’s or ERJ-170’s?
If I were SOU management I’d be doing everything possible to sweeten BACF and keep them happy so that growth is forthcoming. I’m sure they’re already doing this and well done to them!
Does anyone know if the flights are being operated by ERJ-190’s or ERJ-170’s?
davidjohnson6
In the current position, a bird in hand is worth two in the bush (or cash in the bank is worth more than the promise of cash in the future). These BACF weekend schedules have been rather nomadic, so doubt whether any one seriously thinking about a fulltime base would be put off.
We will need to see how quickly LCY recovers. There is at least the possibility that what at the moment is an exercise in keeping a/c earning rather than sitting on the ground might develop into something more substantial for SOU, and that's got to be worthwhile.
Changing the subject, presumably the Bergerac on the Tuesday is a 'W' from LCY?
In the current position, a bird in hand is worth two in the bush (or cash in the bank is worth more than the promise of cash in the future). These BACF weekend schedules have been rather nomadic, so doubt whether any one seriously thinking about a fulltime base would be put off.
We will need to see how quickly LCY recovers. There is at least the possibility that what at the moment is an exercise in keeping a/c earning rather than sitting on the ground might develop into something more substantial for SOU, and that's got to be worthwhile.
Changing the subject, presumably the Bergerac on the Tuesday is a 'W' from LCY?
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Well, that explains the appearance in the BA.com destinations menu right enough!
This is a good match. For Cityflyer, they find a weekend home for their aircraft outside LCY that doesn't involve a battle on price against Ryanair, Jet2, easyJet & others as the weekend operations at STN and MAN did. For SOU, they get the weekend leisure flying covered with a very credible carrier and even if that airline isn't paying much at SOU, the volume going through the airport and generating spend is good. The local perception of having BA flying from SOU is also a major boost and having these routes back on the map (and some new ones too) is a real plus.
I view it as good news in the most diabolical of times and I'm not inclined to agree with the views of those of a negative disposition towards it.
This is a good match. For Cityflyer, they find a weekend home for their aircraft outside LCY that doesn't involve a battle on price against Ryanair, Jet2, easyJet & others as the weekend operations at STN and MAN did. For SOU, they get the weekend leisure flying covered with a very credible carrier and even if that airline isn't paying much at SOU, the volume going through the airport and generating spend is good. The local perception of having BA flying from SOU is also a major boost and having these routes back on the map (and some new ones too) is a real plus.
I view it as good news in the most diabolical of times and I'm not inclined to agree with the views of those of a negative disposition towards it.
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Another potential benefit for SOU is that these flights should be pretty visible to BA's London customer base, perhaps more so than any flights operated by other carriers from SOU.
Head for points and other websites will be read by a lot of business travellers in the London area, so now they'll know that there are holiday flights from the airport down the road that they can spend and acquire Avios points on. This may entice a few more SW London passengers to drive down the M3 or jump on the train than may otherwise have been the case.
Head for points and other websites will be read by a lot of business travellers in the London area, so now they'll know that there are holiday flights from the airport down the road that they can spend and acquire Avios points on. This may entice a few more SW London passengers to drive down the M3 or jump on the train than may otherwise have been the case.
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The EDI base was closed earlier this year. The previous MAN and STN weekend ops (plus GLA charters) saw crews night stopping so would imagine this will be the same. Remember that these aircraft only have four crew in total.
The EDI base was closed earlier this year. The previous MAN and STN weekend ops (plus GLA charters) saw crews night stopping so would imagine this will be the same. Remember that these aircraft only have four crew in total.
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Just a projection at what the departure board might look like over the summer period , pretty impressive have to say
Looks like 6 night stopping E 190 !!!
Just out of interest is there enough stands for this type of aircraft or would some have to parked at a different area of the airport
Friday
2050 EDI 190
2235 BER. 190
Saturday
190 IBZ 0645
190 PMI 0805
1045. EGC. 190 LIG 1130
1220. IBZ. 190. EGC 1420
1305 PMI. 319 PMI 1330 Volotoa
1310. PMI 190 FLR. 1440
1345. PMI 190. FAO. 1450
1355. AGP 190. AGP. 1505
1410 IBZ 190 NCE
1500. LIG 190
1715. JMK. 190
1800. EGC. 190
1940. FLR. 190
2030. NCE. 190
2125. FAO. 190
Sunday
190 FLR 0730
190. IBZ 0755
190. PMI 0800
190 EDI 0900
190 EGC 0915
190. JMK 1000
1230 FLR. 190. BER 1320
1335. PMI 190. AGP. 1420
Looks like 6 night stopping E 190 !!!
Just out of interest is there enough stands for this type of aircraft or would some have to parked at a different area of the airport
Friday
2050 EDI 190
2235 BER. 190
Saturday
190 IBZ 0645
190 PMI 0805
1045. EGC. 190 LIG 1130
1220. IBZ. 190. EGC 1420
1305 PMI. 319 PMI 1330 Volotoa
1310. PMI 190 FLR. 1440
1345. PMI 190. FAO. 1450
1355. AGP 190. AGP. 1505
1410 IBZ 190 NCE
1500. LIG 190
1715. JMK. 190
1800. EGC. 190
1940. FLR. 190
2030. NCE. 190
2125. FAO. 190
Sunday
190 FLR 0730
190. IBZ 0755
190. PMI 0800
190 EDI 0900
190 EGC 0915
190. JMK 1000
1230 FLR. 190. BER 1320
1335. PMI 190. AGP. 1420
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This is great news for SOU, but interestingly compared to previous route / airline launches at the airport from KLM, EasyJet and Volotea the reaction on social media is massive and I have seen numerous posts all over FB and Twitter from people who are not in the industry / interested in airliners etc sharing and commenting on the news. It's clear the value that the flag carrier has is huge and will likely generate demand in its own good. South Hampshire is the UK's 8th largest urban area and Hampshire has the largest economy in the UK outside of London/Surrey/Manchester/West Mids and could easily sustain demand, particularly with the high number of regular BA flyers in the area that would more than happily use the airport in comparison to places such as MAN, BRS and BHX.
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On a separate note it looks like Easy jet have pretty much binned the Geneva route for this winter, with the Saturday service gone in March now
With France wanting to keep the ski slopes closed it’s not really a surprise
With France wanting to keep the ski slopes closed it’s not really a surprise
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Presumably four will use stands 2,3,4,5 and the other two would have to use stand 13 and 14 which would be problematic security/boarding wise. In the past SOU have parked Flybe/Aurigny ERJs on the taxiway behind stands 2,3,4,5 so maybe a repeat of that?